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PostPosted: Sat Jan 02, 2010 12:33 pm 
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Joined: Wed Nov 04, 2009 10:32 am
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Location: Germany
:o
:lol:

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PostPosted: Sat Jan 02, 2010 12:58 pm 
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Joined: Wed Aug 12, 2009 6:22 pm
Posts: 441
Location: Clearwater, FL
Hi Guys:
Happy New Year everyone.

I'll just add a little to what Rick wrote as he likes these bits of trivia.

During calendar year 1970 there were about 20,000 Series I 240Z's shipped to America (the US and Canada). Canada seems to have received about 10% of them. So in round numbers that would have been 18,000 240Z's during the year into the U.S. - spread among an average of 900 US Dealers. If you use "averages" you get 1.67 units per dealer per month.

In reality Nissan didn't use "averages" on a National basis - they used the Dealerships average sales per month - when allocating Z's. So what happened was the large volume Dealerships received far more Z's per month than the low volume dealers.

Also - production of the Series I cars in the first half of Calendar Year 1970 equaled about 7K units, with 13K units in the second half of the year. Which means that small or newer Dealerships in the middle of the US might have received only 1 or 2 Z's by Mid-Year!

In calendar year 1971 - there were about 24K Series II Z's built though 09/71; Plus another 17K Series III Z's {1972 Model Year}. So 41,000 total and 36,900 for the US divided by 900 = 3.4 units per Dealer per month.

You can move the numbers around as you wish - yes, cars produced in Dec. of 1970 would not have arrived in the US until Jan. of 71 and so forth with 71.... Anyway you look at it - it is easy to see that it would have been quite easy for any Datsun Dealer in the US to have sold 3 to 5 times as many 240Z's as they received in calendar years 70/71. For that matter the same was true for 72/73. Nissan simply did not have the production capacity to meet the demand.

My understanding was that the lack of "Black" Z's was the result of market research in the US. There simply had not been a successful history in prior years selling any Black Sports Cars. By the middle of 1977 however Nissan had heard from enough of its Dealers and End Customers that they decided to Test Market a Black Z in 78. That was the purpose of the Limited Black Pearl Edition 280Z in 78. Black then became a standard color for the 280ZX's...

Bob Sharp is said to have painted a 240Z Black for Mr. Kawazoe, the East Coast VP of Nissan. However when Nissan HQ in Japan heard of it - they made him put that Z back into the Customer Pool as 240Z's were in such demand at the time. I believe that Dr. Robbins has that car today... There was a picture of it taken with Mr. Goertz standing beside it.... but Mr. Goertz stated that he never actually owned a 240Z.

FWIW,
Carl B.


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PostPosted: Sat Jan 02, 2010 1:44 pm 
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Joined: Wed Apr 09, 2008 5:53 pm
Posts: 14778
Location: CT
Well, I had thought this Thread was getting a bit far away from "my" car, but this last entry hits home.

My #02807 was sold from the Honolulu Datsun showroom where, in the summer of 1970, FOUR 1970 Z cars were sold. Unbelievably, we have accounted for THREE of those four cars today ~ and they all traveled about 7,000 miles to live within 400 miles of each other here in the NY/CT area :shock: . Very weird.

I plan to get my #02807 to Rochester this year, for a photograph with the other two Hawaii cars. Maybe we'll send that photo and background info to NISSAN SPORT Magazine, too!

Frank


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PostPosted: Sat Jan 02, 2010 2:02 pm 
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Joined: Thu May 14, 2009 9:24 am
Posts: 1373
Location: Webster, NY
Carl Beck wrote:
Hi Guys:
Happy New Year everyone.

My understanding was that the lack of "Black" Z's was the result of market research in the US. There simply had not been a successful history in prior years selling any Black Sports Cars. By the middle of 1977 however Nissan had heard from enough of its Dealers and End Customers that they decided to Test Market a Black Z in 78. That was the purpose of the Limited Black Pearl Edition 280Z in 78. Black then became a standard color for the 280ZX's...

Bob Sharp is said to have painted a 240Z Black for Mr. Kawazoe, the East Coast VP of Nissan. However when Nissan HQ in Japan heard of it - they made him put that Z back into the Customer Pool as 240Z's were in such demand at the time. I believe that Dr. Robbins has that car today... There was a picture of it taken with Mr. Goertz standing beside it.... but Mr. Goertz stated that he never actually owned a 240Z.

FWIW,
Carl B.


Hi All.

Yes, Dr. Robbins indeed owns the 240Z that was painted black for Mr. Kawazoe. That car was born red and painted black. The black 240Z was not appreciated by Nissan and it was indeed returned for sale in its original color. Today it is undergoing a period correct restoration (in black) at Robbin's Sharpsite Racing shop.

PS- This was the car photographed with Goertz, but he had no relation to it other than the magazine article in which the picture appeared.

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John Taddonio
1970 240Z
1977 530Z
1984 300ZXT
zcarnut@hotmail.com
FB: Zccr zcarclubofrochester


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PostPosted: Sat Jan 02, 2010 3:38 pm 
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Joined: Sun Sep 20, 2009 7:19 pm
Posts: 1301
Location: 5 mi. from Frank
This is so great, no, YOU GUYS are great.

As Carl said, I enjoy reminiscing about the early days of the Z after
being away for over 30 years.

Every time Carl, Frank, John T, or anyone else shares who has been
around Zs for a long time, I get animated all over again. And invar-
iably I learn something new with each of their postings. Thanks, guys!

But an even further joy I get from these brothers is the realization
that those members who didn't own, couldn't afford, or were too young
to own or drive a Z, or maybe weren't even born yet, also get some
insights into what it was like in the early days of the Z. Moreover, by
learning the history of the ZCar they are better able to appreciate their
own Z cars even more as we "Old Guys" (not me!) record our thoughts
and experiences for posterity.

Maybe we are in the process of compiling a Z History book without even
realizing it! Love you guys. Thanks for accepting us into the group.

All Z Best,...................Kathy & Rick

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All Z Best,.......Kathy & Rick

1969 Z.CAR (#00013 10/69) 8/30/76
1969 ITSA.Z (#00171 11/69) 8/24/73
1970 OLD.Z (#06289 6/70) original owner
1971 510 2dr since 12/31/75
1969 1600 rdstr (our 160-Z)
1971 (#19851 1/71) sold
1975 75.Z (#01343 1/75)


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri May 13, 2011 11:27 pm 
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Joined: Wed Apr 09, 2008 5:53 pm
Posts: 14778
Location: CT
I'm unsure why I failed to post this picture when the event happened, but later is better than never.

At the Z Car Club of Rochester's All Japanese Car Weekend last year, one of my "Z Dreams" came true. I drove 02807 to Rochester and parked it alongside the two other 1970 240Zs which were sold by Honolulu Datsun in the summer of 1970.

As Rick has said, each Datsun dealer was allotted a certain number of 1970 Zs to sell, based upon their general business volume. Larger (or high-selling) dealers got more 1970 240Zs than lesser dealers did.

In 1970, Honolulu Datsun got FOUR 240Zs to sell. Of those, these three cars have moved (by independent circumstances) nearly 7,000 miles to live within 400 miles of each other (and belong to the same Club together) today! :shock:

Our member John Taddonio owns the perfectly restored gold Z, our member Shawn Pritchard owns the completely original white Z, and the blue one is mine. The fourth Z has not been found. Mine was the last Z sold by Honolulu Datsun that year (and that's ANOTHER long story!)

This event marked the first time these three 1970 cars had sat together since 1970! I know they had a lot of miles to talk about during their reunion :D

Frank


Attachments:
File comment: 75% of all the 240Zs sold by Honolulu Datsun in 1970!
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IMG_0390.JPG [ 175.66 KiB | Viewed 14586 times ]
File comment: Reunited after 40 years! Three of the four 1970 240Zs sold by Honolulu Datsun
IMG_0389.JPG
IMG_0389.JPG [ 176.8 KiB | Viewed 14586 times ]

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat May 14, 2011 12:24 am 
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Joined: Mon Jul 21, 2008 9:27 pm
Posts: 959
Location: Pachaug, Ct
Just an incredible piece of Z history.
One of the highlights of the trip.
Add in #s 6,8?,13...it'z a thrill every time I think about that weekend!

Al


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PostPosted: Sat May 14, 2011 7:39 am 
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Joined: Sun Sep 20, 2009 7:19 pm
Posts: 1301
Location: 5 mi. from Frank
alllan71 wrote:
Just an incredible piece of Z history.
One of the highlights of the trip.
Add in #s 6,8?,13...it'z a thrill every time I think about that weekend!
Al


Good point, Al, and it looks like it's going to happen again this year!

BTW your comment was especially interesting since the three cars you
mentioned are also in the picture behind the three Pineapples: from
front to rear VIN 00006 (red/white/blue #33); VIN 00008 (white/blue
#27); and VIN 00013 (that nondescript gold thing with no racing #).

Too bad Ron Cooke couldn't have made it up from L.A. with his VIN
00007 race car, nor Jimbo Frederick with his pretty VIN 00016. Then
all 5 of the earliest Z's known to still be in existence would have been
in one place at one time. Wouldn't that have been one for the books!

Well, maybe someday. John T and all his Mikes do a wonderful job.

All Z Best,............................Kathy & Rick

_________________
All Z Best,.......Kathy & Rick

1969 Z.CAR (#00013 10/69) 8/30/76
1969 ITSA.Z (#00171 11/69) 8/24/73
1970 OLD.Z (#06289 6/70) original owner
1971 510 2dr since 12/31/75
1969 1600 rdstr (our 160-Z)
1971 (#19851 1/71) sold
1975 75.Z (#01343 1/75)


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat May 14, 2011 10:47 am 
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Joined: Mon Jul 21, 2008 9:27 pm
Posts: 959
Location: Pachaug, Ct
The 'Three Pineapples'...I love it!
You just gave me one heckuva tee shirt idea!
Stay tuned...

Al


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PostPosted: Thu May 26, 2011 12:00 am 
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Joined: Wed Mar 24, 2010 8:11 am
Posts: 596
Location: Finland
Frank...i think i found you the fourth one... Look at the pics 8)


Attachments:
honolulu2.jpg
honolulu2.jpg [ 83.41 KiB | Viewed 14510 times ]
honolulu1.jpg
honolulu1.jpg [ 95.27 KiB | Viewed 14510 times ]

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PostPosted: Thu May 26, 2011 12:27 am 
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Joined: Wed Apr 09, 2008 5:53 pm
Posts: 14778
Location: CT
NOW THAT'S CLOSE!!! But no cigar.

Same company (downtown Honolulu, the only Datsun dealership in that city at that time), and the correct year.

But too late to be one of the original 4 1970 cars they sold that summer. It's VIN #10,219, bought in October 1970, which makes it (technically) a 1971 Z car.

My 240 (#02807) was the final car sold that summer. The original owner (Stanley B) was told the car was already sold and paid for, and the owner was on HER way to pick it up as they spoke. Honolulu Datsun would not be getting any more 1970 240Zs. Stanley was told he could make a deposit and order one just like it, but it would be a 1971 model and would not arrive until Fall 1970.

Stanley reluctantly sat down and began the paperwork to order his "1971" 240Z. The lady who had bought/paid for #02807 came in and interrupted the salesman while she took delivery of her new Z.

Stanley walked around the car with her, listening to the salesman's explanation of how everything worked. The lady drove "my" Z away and Stanley sadly watched it go, then sat down to continue his purchase order for a new Z.

The lady drove around a 2 block area and brought the car back to the lot, protesting that she hated the car, couldn't see anything from that low, and couldn't drive it well. She demanded a sedan with an automatic transmission and Stanley jumped up and yelled that HE was buying #02807 and he didn't care who he had to pay!

I think he told me that was early June 1970. The car in this photo was bought in Oct 1970, which sounds exactly correct with Stanley's story about what the salesman told him.

So I thank you for the effort, but this isn't the missing 1970 240Z from Honolulu. They arrived together in May and were gone by June.

Frank

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PostPosted: Thu May 26, 2011 12:35 am 
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Joined: Wed Mar 24, 2010 8:11 am
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Location: Finland
I'll keep on searching then :P

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PostPosted: Thu May 26, 2011 12:41 am 
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Joined: Wed Apr 09, 2008 5:53 pm
Posts: 14778
Location: CT
ME TOO! :lol:

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PostPosted: Thu May 26, 2011 6:57 am 
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Joined: Thu May 14, 2009 9:24 am
Posts: 1373
Location: Webster, NY
I actually had a nice chat with the owner of that silver 10/70 Hawaii Z at ZCON last year. A passionate owner as we all are.

Frank is correct, the 240Zs SLOWLY were allotted to dealers in the early days of 1970. My original owner placed his name on the Hawaii dealer's wait list in January 1970 and finally got the call in June. There were THREE cars for him to choose from: green w/tan int., white w/blue interior (Shawn's car!) and gold w/black interior (which he chose and eventually became mine). Frank's car must have been in a slightly earlier allotment, judging by his VIN number. In any event, it is truly remarkable that these cars have SURVIVED 41 years and thousands of miles to be reunited in the northeast USA!

ZCCR's car show on July 9 will again showcase all of these cars along with #s 6, 8 and 13. IN ADDITION, we hope to have the Don Devendorf Electromotive 280ZX, Sam Posey BSR 240Z championship car, some SCCA Mazdas, Porsches and Jags. We've tried to track down HLS30-00007 (with help from pal Carl Beck) and have been unsuccessful so far.

In any event, this year's show will showcase the OLDEST and most FAMOUS Z-Cars in any show! Where else can you see that? Add in awesome import rides from EVERY country, and it will be a show to remember.

We hope to Z YOU THERE!

Register HERE:

http://www.zccr.net/main/Uploaded/2011_ ... n_Form.pdf

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John Taddonio
1970 240Z
1977 530Z
1984 300ZXT
zcarnut@hotmail.com
FB: Zccr zcarclubofrochester


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PostPosted: Thu May 26, 2011 8:59 am 
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Joined: Wed Apr 09, 2008 5:53 pm
Posts: 14778
Location: CT
I'm not sure I can draw any deductions or conclusions from the very early VINs. Carl, Rick, John and Kats have all said enough about 1970 production and shipping woes to make me realiZe that those early carz didn't leave the factory according to VIN number. It's normal that the Hawaiian "Pineapple" carz would be numbered within a few hundred units of each other, but I see little (if any) chance of them being sequentially numbered.

My 02807 was built in April 1970. We don't know much about why it was sent to Honolulu. Was it a pre-paid special order? Was it sent as a 'general population' car? We don't know. What we do know is that 02807 had two dealer options added to it: ANSA dual exhaust system and 5-slot American magnesium wheels w/fat tires. Aside from that it was a "Plain Jane" 240Z, originally in factory Silver (901) with black interior. It had no lightbars, no roof racks, no side moldings.

The older lady who originally ordered and paid for the car was not Hawaiian. Stan said she was a 'spoiled HOULE" ("white foreigner" in Hawaiian) who lived there. She had apparently ordered the car without seeing it first, maybe on someone's recommendation. Stanley was sure she was seeing 02807 for the first time, as he walked around it with her and the salesman. Stanley loved the car. She (thankfully) had some doubts and ultimately rejected or returned my car.

I can easily picture a scenario for John's original owner to zee only 3 carz to chose from, if I picture #02807 (already paid for and no longer for sale) in the service area, getting ANSAs and Mag wheels mounted to it.

But we may never know those details. We'll be very fortunate to ever learn the VIN on the 4th car, which would be the Green/Tan unit. It would be astounding if THAT car also left Hawaii, so the search should begin there. Honolulu Datsun has closed (under that name), possibly when they reverted to NISSAN. The islands now have a network of NISSAN dealerships, which complicates the search.

The info I have on my car came from Stanley (first-hand witness), and the Service, Sales and General managers of Honolulu Datsun when I brought the car to them for service throughout my time in Hawaii. Today I don't know if I was the 2nd owner or the 3rd ~ did they reverse the sales deal and give the lady a sedan, then sell 02807 to Stanley, or did he have to buy it directly from her?

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