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Rear Disc Brakes/ Bearings
http://forums.ctzcc.com/viewtopic.php?f=15&t=7307		 Page 1 of 2
Author:  Paul [ Sun Feb 24, 2013 10:57 am ]
Post subject:  Rear Disc Brakes/ Bearings
Just ordered all the parts I needed to convert to rear disc brakes and bearings as well. Using a combination of MSA and Rock Auto. MSA= Adapters, slotted cross drilled rotors, hardware, steel lines, Hawk pads, and Motul brake fluid.....RA= Maxima calipers, Timken Rear Bearings, Beck Arnley seals.........Total $977 So the bearings are going to be so much fun, :roll: :cry: but the conversion should be more fun. :D
Author:  Paul [ Tue Feb 26, 2013 7:40 pm ]
Post subject: 
Parts are starting to arrive, gettin that Z fever, come on spring. :D Anyone with experience doing this......Says you need NO Proportioning Valve. Is that so? That means a few less onces of weight on the car. :?
Author:  rob240z [ Tue Feb 26, 2013 8:20 pm ]
Post subject: 
Hi Paul,

This is the same brake conversion I'm doing too. I think you already knew that. I assumed I needed to put in an adjustable proportioning valve. Where did you read that you do not? If it's not needed I guess we should just not put it in and then test it out. If the back brakes lock up 1st that would be bad and we could always add it later if need be. I would think if you are going to be tracking your car a lot you should use the proportioning valve to dial it in right where you like it.
Author:  Paul [ Wed Feb 27, 2013 10:50 am ]
Post subject: 
I did consider the adjustable PV, but MSA, the ones that sell the conversion kit says you dont, but I still ask the question from those that have done this. I think the kit you have is a slightly different make? Looked like steel adapters from the pick? The ones I'm getting are billet aluminum. All does the same job. :wink:
Author:  Datsun Z Garage [ Thu Feb 28, 2013 4:18 pm ]
Post subject:  Re:
I did that conversion last year to my '70 240: 280ZX rear discs with Maxima calipers and new wheel bearings. I have a lot say here......Yes you can replace just the brakes without touching the wheel bearings but this is the proper time to replace everything.

The stock 240z came with a preset proportioning valve, its inline with the main rear brake line near the gas tank. You 'can' put the disks/calipers on without touching the stock prop valve...but expecting the balance between front/rear to be perfect is asking a lot, especially since the stock prop valve is expecting drums. So I went and removed my factory prop valve and since I have the Toyota 4x4 calipers in the front I decided I would fix any balance problems at the same time.

I went with this valve.
http://www.wilwood.com/MasterCylinders/MasterCylinderProd.aspx?itemno=260-11179

BIG PROBLEM:
Our brake fittings are all 10mmx1.0 while everything else out there uses a 3/8x24. I searched VERY HARD but no one makes a 10mm to 3/8 line adaptor. This means you're stuck if you want to use 10mm lines, a stock master cylinder and add a new Wilwood proportioning valve.

SOLUTION
I bought a flaring tool and big spool of brake line...and fabricated new lines with a 3/8 fitting on one end and 10mm on the other. This let me plug everything into the stock master cylinder with the new prop valve. It was very tedious though. If I had to do it again I would do the brake conversion/bearings first and worry about the brake lines later. I'll post some photos tonight.
Author:  Paul [ Fri Mar 01, 2013 9:55 am ]
Post subject: 
Thanks for the info. Well my things is this is all started because I HAVE to replace my bearings. Got the grind. I also want to save all my original parts, so don't want to cut backing plate off like I have seen online. So what about the adjustable Proportioning valve on MSA? Would't be made to fit our metric lines? Not that I can't make any brake line out there, but the less work the better.
Author:  Datsun Z Garage [ Fri Mar 01, 2013 10:33 am ]
Post subject:  re:
If you look at the description of the prop valve on the MSA website it says: "Note: Installation requires modification and replacement of stock connectors."

To me this doesn't sound like they're including adaptors, but might be worth a phone call to make sure.

You CAN find pre-made 10mm lines and raw 10mm connectors at Advance Auto and Napa...but it's the conversion to 3/8 that's the problem. All the brake companies seem to be making new products with SAE or -AN sizes...our old metric Zs are getting left behind.

Flaring my own lines was the only solution I could come up with.
Author:  Datsun Z Garage [ Fri Mar 01, 2013 11:15 pm ]
Post subject:  Photos
I decided to pull the struts off the car for mine. I used a dremel tool to cut the peened edges off the nut. This let me spin it off with an impact wrench. If you damage the first couple of threads you can get a "thread file" and regroove them. The tightened nut sits below the top threads so no fear...

Image

Rather than use the slide hammer method I pressed the flanges out, took 2 seconds.

Image

40 year old grease. Note the sleeve that sits above the bearing. This is the spacer that both inner bearings races tighten against. Don't lose it!

Image

I rented this puller from Autozone to get the inner bearing off. It was on very tight.

Image

Quality grease, I pressed in new lug bolts too.

Image

Using a pipe to press the bearing back on was easy...a hammer method would certainly damage them.

Image

This is what things look like without backing plates.

Image

Back together.

Image
Author:  Frank T [ Sat Mar 02, 2013 10:42 am ]
Post subject: 
Clean work.

So, have you determined if there's a difference in swept area before and after?
Author:  Paul [ Sat Mar 02, 2013 12:08 pm ]
Post subject: 
This makes me more anxious. :D So far the bearings and calipers came in the mail, now waiting for the MSA delivery. I will borrow the tool from work that allows you to press hub bearing out on the car. Also Heat does wonders. I do wish myself good luck. I have done ones on the 280zx models, so now to do this on a 41 year old car. :shock: I'm starting this early, so not in a hurry for last minute car show preps. Been there done that. I'll make sure I get pics of the project. Thanks Brian for the input. BTW, never saw PVC used, but whatever works, and I guess that stuff is strong. :wink:
Author:  Datsun Z Garage [ Sat Mar 02, 2013 12:46 pm ]
Post subject:  re:
It's actually pretty 'easy' as there are only two parts: the stub axle, and two bearings...getting off/on the nut is the tricky part. As you've probably read the 280ZX replacement nut is the one to put back on as it self-peens.

I started using PCV to drive bearings on when I rebuilt my transmission. You can cut it to length, its light, and thick walled...and its cheap. Might be unconventional but it works.
Author:  Paul [ Wed Mar 06, 2013 3:29 pm ]
Post subject: 
All parts are finally here. Well Brian the good thing is I already had that nut off to install the CV shafts. So just getting the hub out of the bearings is the only pia thing, but I'm too worried. Just can't wait to see the final result and of course I just have to paint something. So probably going to do the calipers in red.
Author:  Datsun Z Garage [ Wed Mar 06, 2013 7:27 pm ]
Post subject:  re
Sounds good...with the nuts off the rest is simple. Just make sure to keep everything spotless of course.

One final tip: make sure the rubber seal is tapped down fully inside. Otherwise the inner metal flange can rub against it and cause very slight drag when it spins. Notice how this seal is untouched after 40 years of spinning.

Image
Author:  demo243 [ Thu Mar 14, 2013 9:34 am ]
Post subject: 
Datsun Z Garage you wouldnt happen to have any other pictures of the process for removing and replacing the wheel bearings would you? Your thread is the first one I have found that gives me anything- a full walk through would be awesome... but that might take some time...

I am in the process of prepping my 510 for the Auto X Rookie school on the 23rd and I have some play in the back wheel - seems to be in the hub area...

If I grab the lugs and plate I can wiggle it back and fourth a hair bit and it appears to be wiggling around in the housing- which makes me think bad bearings... unleass its possible that that nut just came loose and needs to be tightened- like how my front hubs were- they had play, so I pulled them apart and the nuts were finger tight, bearings all seemed fine so repacked them and torqued the nut down and all is well- wish the rears were that easy

From looking at your shots it looks like the z and the 510 have similar set ups - reading through my Haynes manual it makes it sound much easier, with no mention of grinding off a peaned nut or needing a press... but reading around on ratsun I get the same info you show (ie grinding the nut ect)

Also on the topic of wheel bearings - where is the best place to source those bearings and the replacement nut- esspecially since I may end up on a tight timeline

Thanks a bunch

Devon
Author:  Datsun Z Garage [ Thu Mar 14, 2013 3:26 pm ]
Post subject:  Re:
This guy covers it very well, he has lots more photos than me. I don't quite agree with his method of hammering on the bearing...seems risky to the bearing. I would use a PVC pipe to drive it on from the the inner race...like in the photo of my bench press... so its pressed on straight and flush.

http://atlanticz.ca/zclub/techtips/rearwheelbearings/index.html

Rockauto.com looks like it has the bearings for a 510.

I don't know if it applies to the 510 but this is the part# for the self-locking nuts that replace the stock peened ones: 43262-W1200
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